ARTICLES

Men of Good Will Can Disagree

Just War Theory Is Not Algebra

By Allyson Smith

Rev. Paul Shaughnessy, S.J., is a Marine Corps and Navy chaplain currently stationed in San Diego aboard the USS Belleau Wood. He wrote an essay, "The Gay Priest Problem," published in the November 2000 issue of Catholic World Report -- more than a year before the Boston Globe broke the scandals in the Archdiocese of Boston. Last June, Fr. Shaughnessy penned another essay, "Are the Jesuits Catholic?," in the Weekly Standard.

Father Shaughnessy, 53, agreed to an April 11 interview in San Diego.

Smith: Please explain the nuances of the Pope's position on the Iraq war.

Fr. Shaughnessy: The just war tradition begins with the decision to go to war, not the conduct of the war. It's jus ad bellum versus jus in bello. The presumption to go to war is justice: There has to be a just cause. That's the first element of statecraft. The state has an obligation and duty to see that justice is done.

Now, what has happened in the last few years is that the presumption has changed to one that says, "All evil is wrong; any evil or violence, or use of violence, is wrong." But that it's not really the presumption of the just war decision; rather, the presumption is, "Is it a just cause?" That is what determines the decision to go to war.

But what has happened is that they have inverted just war theory because of the nuclear threat, using the argument of proportionality, because you can't discriminate about who gets hit with nuclear weapons. In other words, they've replaced the decision to go to war with the conduct in war. However, the presumption of the just war theory is not against violence; it is "Is this a just cause?" If justice is to reign, there has to be a minimum of freedom and a minimum of order, because if you don't have those, you're not going to have justice.

Now, it's interesting what I find with the liberals. All of a sudden they're trying to invoke some type of infallible statements with the Pope's comments on this war, especially [former Notre Dame theology chairman] Richard McBrien, et al. They are not quite that deliberate about it, but they're certainly insinuating it. But where the Church has clear teaching on sexual ethics, they clearly don't agree with the Pope, which is hypocritical on their part. So all of a sudden, Michael Novak and George Weigel become the object of doubt about their fidelity to papal teaching, which is total hypocrisy. The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops says that men of goodwill can disagree about this. This idea that somehow we're dissenting from papal teaching is really not relevant.

There are degrees of infallibility. There is the ordinary magisterium, and then there is the extraordinary magisterium, which is rarely used, but neither of those were invoked in this case. The Holy Father was primarily concerned about non-combatants. However, as we found out subsequently, the injustice going on within Iraq really exceeds the notion of charity, which is what St. Thomas uses. St. Augustine uses justice; Thomas Aquinas, in the just war theory, invokes charity. It is putting into practice "Love thy neighbor."

Of course, the Jesuits came up with tyrannicide, which is the theory that a tryant may be assassinated on the basis that when an individual declares war against his own people, like Idi Amin or Mao Tse Tung, it may serve justice to take them out or assassinate them. There is some doubt about that. Idi Amin killed about 500,000 of his own people. I'm not suggesting that we now use assassination as a way to handle our problems, but with an injustice and horror on that scale, do the people have the right to defend themselves or to defend the common good? Again, the Pope is just offering his view of it. However, it is not infallible teaching, and they know that.

The other interesting thing, and Weigel makes this point too, is that the just war theory is not algebra where you have clear-cut, ready-made solutions independent of the circumstances. It is more like a calculus, where reason and empirical evidence are used to ascertain whether this is a just war. So, this preconceived notion that the Iraq war is automatically unjust is not really an honest appraisal of just war tradition.

Smith: Do you think that we had enough information about what was going on inside Iraq before we went to war, to have engaged in the war?

Fr. Shaughnessy: My presumption is that they certainly had some intelligence on the weapons of mass destruction. What I'm surprised at is the level of torture that was used against people who disagreed. I knew there was some, but I didn't know that it was to that level. There were horrendous kinds of torture used. So that in itself, to me, would be grounds for some type of military measure, again in proportion. It would be one thing to go in and destroy the country, but I think our military has been very careful not to hit non-military targets.

Another concern is that Nietzsche said there is always the danger that when you fight an enemy, you become like that enemy. I think the United States, in the way we have conducted this war, has been pretty careful not to involve non-combatants or to destroy religious sites. We were very sensitive to not destroy all those Islamic sites, because that would be a violation of international law.

Smith: Does the Pope speak with more than one voice on this war? Who else in the Vatican speaks on his behalf?

Fr. Shaughnessy: Obviously, the Vatican Secretary of State, Cardinal Angelo Sodano, and the Pope are in consultation. The Pope speaks with one voice. Our own secretary of state, Colin Powell, doesn't agree with Donald Rumsfeld on everything, so I'm sure within the Vatican itself there's going to be some of that.

The Pope's reasoning is that violence in and of itself is only going to exacerbate the whole situation in the Middle East. I think he's very concerned about that, especially about non-combatants getting killed and the feeling in the Middle East that their concerns are not being considered, particularly the Palestinian question.

However, that's not definitive teaching, and our own conference of bishops has said men of goodwill can disagree about this. I tend to disagree with the pope's assessment, but I don't want to be thought of as somehow trying to undermine his authority.

The just war tradition also says that society has an obligation to defend itself against unjust aggressors. How does one deal with this problem and with what was going on Iraq? Nobody wants to go to war, but Saddam Hussein had 12 years to comply with a resolution he signed, and he didn't. I don't want to undermine the Pope's goodwill, and that's what it is, toward all men. However, it seems to me that the decision to take on Hussein was important for the sake of justice, because justice cannot prevail if you don't have freedom and good order, which were both lacking in Iraq. So I'm inclined to think the United States did the right thing.

Smith: What do your sailors or fellow officers think of the Pope's position? Do they agree with you?

Fr. Shaughnessy: It's very interesting how, even among non-Catholics, the respect for this Pope is phenomenal. And it's been very interesting to see how concerned they are about what he said. He has a certain moral stature outside the Catholic faith, and the non-Catholics wanted to understand exactly what he was saying. What were his reasons? Why was he so adamantly opposed to the war? I don't think they agreed with him, but I was impressed by the fact they even cared. I think that most of them were for this operation, but there were concerns because of the moral legitimacy of the war.

I think too, out of respect for him, they didn't want to appear hostile. I think they have honest intellectual disagreement with him, but because of his stature and his conduct during the Cold War, when he stood with the Poles and Solidarity to defy the Soviet Union and because of his relationship with Ronald Reagan, he won a lot of favor among the military.

Smith: What are your conversations with diocesan priests about the war like?

Fr. Shaughnessy: I don't talk a lot with diocesan priests, but I'm on the Presbyteral Council (of the Diocese of San Diego), so they're very cautious. I don't know if they know I'm the guy who wrote The Gay Priest Problem.

[Next issue of News Notes: Father Shaughnessy talks about the gay priest problem and other subjects. "The Gay Priest Problem" was re-printed in the News Notes in December, 2000]

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